We Told You So

It’s a longer episode this week with one instead of two and Shawna is extra punchy on no sleep after a long week… buckle up!

Another Media Roundup and we hate to say it, but we told you so.

Everything we warned is now playing out in real time. Steve breaks down the latest in his SRP CRD “Frankenstein” is Alive, and how the policies we flagged have materialized with consequences. The State Farm investigation, fine, and license questions and ask the obvious: who actually benefits? (Hint: not fire survivors.) See Shawna’s breakdown on the Beautiful Altadena Substack, along with her recently published guide on how to dodge bad contractors. 

A Tragic Death & the NPO Money Trail

News out of the Palisades following the tragic death of Larry Vein, founder of Pali Strong, and the controversy over a $500K FireAid grant he reportedly hadn’t asked for and was trying to return. One of the most uncomfortable but necessary conversations remains where is the money is actually going? We examine the fiscal sponsorship model and how funds are skimmed at multiple levels. Steve breaks down “laundering appropriations” and “supply funds,” and how similar dynamics are playing out in disaster recovery. Year two is often the hardest for disaster survivors and we are in it. Check in with yourself and each other. Don't forget 988 is there for anyone who needs support. No one needs to suffer in silence. 

County vs Community

We dive into the growing disconnect between what the County’s top-down system wants and what the community is actually asking for — a gap that’s coming to a head. We’re seeing it everywhere:

 • Pushback on car wash and storage projects
• PUSD plans to demolish the historic Eliot campus, sparking petitions (and why petitions alone won’t cut it — calls and emails do)
• Ongoing SB9 fallout, lot splits, McMansion creep, and projects like Punahou
• Continued chaos around SCE undergrounding, with residents on Alzada organizing for answers

There’s still no economic development plan and where is the West San Gabriel Valley Plan? Before the next wave of funding hits, it’s time for the Altadena Town Council and community leaders to come together for a Hail Mary, to take charge of directing this rebuild ourselves. If we don’t, the same systems that got us here will decide for us what comes next.

Small Biz Shout-Out

Steve's ode to the dive bar and why we need the Rancho. Netflix Is a Joke bringing live comedy to Eagles Hall this week raising funds and giving fire survivors a much needed laugh. Check out the Rebuilding the Block market nightly from 6–8pm and grab a slice from BLK CRUST Pizza who used to pop up at the Rancho. 

This episode was recorded on Thursday, May 7. 

Transcript

Steve 0:01

Hey there, welcome back to After the Ashes, the beautiful Altadina's opinionated but well-informed podcast on disaster recovery through public public policy a public policy lens. This is your co-host, Steve, and I'm with Shauna.

Shawna 0:17

Shauna Dawson. Hi, everybody.

Steve 0:20

Yeah, I knew you couldn't keep it quiet. And we're recording this episode on the 7th of May. And it is episode 16, season two. I got that part right.

Shawna 0:30

Yeah, it is episode 16 of season two. Um yeah, here we are. Welcome back. So it's been um it's been, what has it been, about two weeks since we recorded last.

SPEAKER_05 0:41

Yeah.

Shawna 0:43

And um we did not think we would manage to record this week because it's been a it's been a busy week for both of us, but um we're jamming this in this morning between some appointments and other things. Um with me on like four hours of sleep.

Steve 0:58

Well, you know, your your your celebrity requires us to uh fuck off, Steve.

Shawna 1:06

Oh, you're oh Steve. I was out too late multiple nights this week, which is not my usual MO. And I have to be reminded that, you know, I am of a certain age. And I if I FA, I FO. I have to go to bed a good reasonable time. Um, otherwise I wake up like, oh, I was awake at five o'clock, like, uh, I was texting Steve, like, Steve, I don't know if I feel well. This might be a problem today.

Steve 1:34

I was like, dude, I get to get my run in.

Shawna 1:37

I know, I know. You can get your run in after this. So we're gonna let's jump right into it. Um, we're gonna start with a media roundup, but our media roundup uh will be a little a little lighter because the a lot of the stories we're gonna talk about today are directly in uh connected to topics that we want to cover as well.

Steve 1:54

Um start on it and then we'll just go down that and just address it in the meeting round up what we were gonna say.

Shawna 2:03

I know, I know, I know, I know. So, you know, I actually want to start this off um with a piece that you wrote recently. Um what was I think it was it last week? It was your um, you know, the SRP CRD Frankenstein is alive. Frankenstein is alive.

SPEAKER_01 2:18

It's alive, it's alive, it's alive.

Shawna 2:21

So Steve doesn't usually go so hard on on folks. Uh that's that's my job. Well, um Steve Steve is the good cop, I'm the bad cop. Um I you know, I'm authoritative, mommy. Steve is, you know, the yes daddy. Uh oh, that sounded terrible. I didn't mean that to sound so rude. Um but you get my gist. I know you get you get my gist.

Steve 2:48

You pick your fight. You pick your fights.

Shawna 2:49

I agreed, agreed. I I've got two marriages under my belt, so I will not be able to do that. And that explains a lot. Hey, they were long. The first was 10, the second was 20.

Steve 3:03

Hey, my dad was married four or five times, so I'm familiar with the dynamic.

Shawna 3:08

Oh my gosh. You wrote a piece. So, anyhow, you you were a little bit more direct than you usually are in um calling out some of the systems that you know that unfortunately continue to fail, us, the county, uh, anyhow, the more than beyond far beyond the county and its machinations. But um I think it is a it was a great idea.

Steve 3:32

Because it's we collected receipts over the year, and now all of a sudden the things that we predicted were gonna happen are in fact happening. And you know, the the thing is that's nice about a piece like that is you can go back and you can reference as we went along the process what we said was going to happen, and effectively it doesn't happen exactly like you predict, but the end result is the same.

Shawna 3:59

Yeah.

Steve 4:00

And that's so we don't have any leverage.

Shawna 4:02

Yep. I know exactly. It was one of the things that we're gonna do. Yeah, yes, we did. When I was just gonna say that when I shared that, that's what I said. I said, I hate to say we told you so, but we told you so. I mean, I nobody wants to say that. I I would love, I say all the time, man, I would love to be wrong. Make me wrong. Give me nothing to talk about. I would love this, I would love nothing more than this. I'll get back in my garden, you know, like I have other shit to do. Um, but you know, this um it's maddening that everything that we have been talking about for the for the many months, we've been doing this since last year, but also um that you have been talking about even before this podcast came to be, and that I was talking about in the rooms that I was in, um, with multiple, you know, organizations that are kind of leading the charge on this recovery um and all of the other various players that you know, you and I both collectively and independently have had so many of these conversations with so many people. No one wanted to listen. That's kind of gonna be the theme of every the theme, I think, of this entire episode is gonna be the fact that um on every front, uh it's like some a lot of our other quote unquote leaders and you know um orgs are like, oh shit. I mean, I have people coming to me like Shauna, well, what are we gonna do about this? Well, like, all right, welcome to the party. I've literally been talking about this shit for a year.

Steve 5:21

Right dollar short. Yeah, I mean, yeah.

Shawna 5:23

And like, we were sounding the alarm.

Steve 5:25

We were sounding the alarm when it was time to do something. And unfortunately, now it's it's gotten to the point. Well, there are options, like, you know, I like like I told you the story about the county. The county's now starting to look to go to banks and private funders to address some of the funding gaps for people who have, you know, concerns about being able to make the difference between the shortfall in insurance and the rebuild costs. I mean, yeah, we've heard all along that, oh no, no, everything's gonna be fine. You know, the federal government's gonna come in and flood the market. Now it's okay, well, we're gonna prop it up and then the federal government's gonna take us out. It really is that at least gives everybody the political win in that they don't have to admit CDBG was wrong, but at the same time, they get the opportunity to do what they should have been doing 16 months ago. Yeah.

Shawna 6:14

Yeah, for an out. There's an out. That's kind of the point. There is an out, there is a path.

Steve 6:18

And so the question becomes some of these broader questions, like we've traded away the CRD, which because our supervisor wanted it so badly, it left us an opportunity because all we wanted was that protest feature in there. And that would allow the community a say to go, hey, you know, we don't like what you're doing, or you're gonna give us what we want, and then we can give you the you know, the the tax increment financing that the county so desperately needed.

SPEAKER_03 6:45

Yep.

Steve 6:46

We trigger it all the way. And every, you know, all summer we top we talked to how many different groups, Shauna? I mean, like, how many different community leaders? Either they looked at us like they had deer in the headlights, or they've said we've got assurances from Sasha and from Catherine that everything's gonna be fine.

Shawna 7:02

And now it's fine.

Steve 7:04

And now look at what's happening. And now Altadina Heritage, you know, wrote that piece. You know, oh my gosh, they're gonna build storage facilities on Woodbury. Well, guys, we're gonna talk about that. Or what about you know the other one that you were talking about yesterday?

Shawna 7:20

I mean we're gonna we're gonna get into all of that. We're gonna get into all of that. I know, I know, I know. Yeah, it's uh it's a lot. It is a lot. Um it's not, it's it's no, no, no, it is at this point. It is at this point, as it is a lot for all these folks to try and come to terms with the fact that you know they were lied to, um, or misled or misguided, and then trying to understand why, like by whom and why, you know, as we always say, like you get a follow-the money following the colour.

Steve 7:51

It was ten billion dollars, and it was about control. And if you can seize the control mechanisms at the time, you got to control the rebuild. And if there were things that were coming into play, why else did they create a CRD separate from an EIFD? The EIFD, which is the enhanced infrastructure or enhanced infrastructure financing district, could have been spun up back in January. It was on the books. But they had to create a climate resilience district because it had to have the token dynamic of, oh, well, this is climate related, number one, which it's really about infrastructure. And number two, uh, we're removing the protest feature because an EIFD requires community buy-in. That's it. It's just like with the with the uh assessor and you know the property tax stuff that we've talked about ad nauseum that nobody seems to want to address. Is why if the assessor can go ahead and give everybody like for like with property tax at the same rate, why have they tried to pass a bill now? They're on their third round of this. Nobody asks the questions because nobody wants to know the answers, and everybody gets told, oh, everything's gonna be fine until it's not. And then for all those people, all those people who go ahead, you know, and they have a property tax basis at$150,000. They get they beg, borrow, steal, get everything they can do to get their house rebuilt, and they turn around and get a million-dollar property tax basis. They're like, I came all the way through and got to the other end of the tunnel under the assumption that things were gonna be fine, and now all of a sudden I gotta pay, I got an extra$1,500 to$2,000 a month on my on top of everything I can't afford anyway. Like, there's a point where the straw is gonna break the camel's back.

Shawna 9:39

Yeah. And we're, I mean, we're there and it's happening.

Steve 9:42

We've been lied to.

Shawna 9:43

Yeah, we've been lied to. And it's the the veil is being lifted. The veil's being lifted, and people are now, you know, both in the community. Well, yeah, and then the community as well. It's not just at the at these other levels, it's also at the at the bottom, at the ground level, at on the ground with the community, where people are starting to realize like, wait, what's happening? And and why is why aren't these orgs doing anything? Why isn't town council doing anything? What why isn't this happening? And they're really the blinders are kind of coming off that you know. These are these well, it's only that, that these are advisory mechanisms. None of them have any real voice, leadership, or power. It is ultimately all everything is the county, it's the truth. You and I know it. Everything is at the county's discretion. They give us the illusion.

Steve 10:31

That's actually not true. That's actually not true. If if the town council so here's the thing the town council was stood up by the county at the outset of this to parrot what you know, Victoria Knapp was able to parrot everything that the county wanted done while she ran it. And so the town council did it, was able was stood up as that indicative representation of our county, of our town, just like the Palace hasn't.

Shawna 10:58

We've talked about this to say it was to rubber stamp.

Steve 11:00

It was to rubber stamp, it was to say, hey, it was to give the impromptu of the idea that the count that the town's elected representatives are supporting what the county's saying. So when the federal government comes in and the federal government says, well, you know, does the town care? The county goes, well, yeah, as much as the town cares, or the county cares, and yes, we technically are the counterparty for all this because the town is unincorporated. Nevertheless, the representation of the town meets that standard. It's something that has to be part of the C DBG money that comes in, is that there has to be community buy-in, and it doesn't just get dictated from a top by the seat by the council or the towny, the county supervisors. So what the town council, by doing that, by supporting all the county's decisions, has given that sense of, well, that everybody's in alignment. But if the town council were to say, you know what, we as the elected representation of the town are not in alignment with what the county's saying. And in fact, we believe that this is to our detriment. I don't think they'll ever do this. But if they were to do that, if it got so bad, that the federal government would say, Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on a second here. Yeah, I'm not sure that's the same.

Shawna 12:12

But I think you made the point right there. It's the federal government that would take note of that.

Steve 12:17

At the end of the day, but at the end of the day, the county doesn't matter. You know, I've had conversations with people back to the EDA stuff, where the only reason why the county's even sitting there is because the state is such a horrible counterparty to the federal government that the county looks good by comparison. But as you and I we talked about time and time again on this podcast, that the county has its own failures and it's no panacea by any stretch of the imagination. So we're at a point where people are saying, well, what's the leverage point? What can we do to affect change? What can we do to get the county to give us what we want? And the answer is for our elected representation, whether advisory or not, to say we aren't in alignment with where the county's going. Because at the end of the day, the only thing that matters to the county besides the property tax, parcel tax going up, is that federal money. And if the feds come in and say, wait a minute, you guys are not in alignment, I mean, that throws the whole thing into disarray.

Shawna 13:19

Yeah.

Steve 13:20

So there's your there's your little nugget for the money.

Shawna 13:22

However, no, I I you know how I feel about this and have felt for a long time. And the the reason I don't sit on that council, uh, because uh I don't know how anyone can sleep at night doing doing that job, to be honest, or being in that role. Because you do have, I think to your point, it is an opportunity even if you don't have the ability to change everything or to do all the things, okay, great. It is an opportunity and not only an opportunity, an imperative to do what you were there to do and to speak up for your neighbors in your community. And that too often just does not happen because again, it's like I think, you know, people we've talked about this before. It's like the county does a really effective job of gaslighting and bullshitting people who are on the council and so that they actually believe the BS that they're being told while simultaneously pandering to them and their egos and trout trouting them, you know, trotting them around town and giving them awards and telling them how great they are. And now they have little jackets with little emblems and they feel very special, but without actually understanding the issues. They don't actually understand what's going on to do anything about it, let alone to speak up. Or worse, or worse, we've had people hold on a second, we've had people who've cycled out of the town council, and we'll just leave it at that, who have straight up told people repeatedly, multiple people on camera, on video, on hot mics, you know, I don't care. I don't care what you think. I'm I don't want to hear it. I don't care. I don't want to hear it. That those people are there for themselves and not for the town. And uh and again, before the fire didn't matter. Like let people have their petty fiefdoms and be, you know, a big fish and a or a mid fish in a very tiny pond, have fun. But now, you know, there is consequence, and this is it. We're paying the price now.

Steve 15:06

The decisions they made have real consequences, and correct. While they may not have even understood what was going on, and I'll give our town council leadership, you know, while the fire was going on, it was it was a heady time, and there were a lot of decisions that are being made. And, you know, what are you gonna do? You're gonna listen to some voices from the outside that may or may not know what they're talking about. You're gonna listen to the supervisor and the advisors coming from the state and the elected representatives and those who are getting awards of being, you know, the person of the year. Like that it I get it. I get that. However, when you're in an elected position and you want the accolades, you also have to look at what the consequences of those decisions are, and you have to listen to all voices. And you can't just minimize those voices that don't necessarily align with where you want to be. Right. And and you know, because what happens is the decisions or non-decisions, because not making a decision is still a decision that you made during that time in those positions have consequences, and today we're seeing those consequences, and we're seeing the results of those decisions, and those decisions are a myriad, right? Like the decision, the land use decisions that are starting here are test cases to see how far the community is going to push back. Yeah, and to test the limits of how far the the stranglehold on the different committees and the different organizations that are the voice of the community. I mean, it's not just the town council, it's a lot of the it's all the leadership positions that are very effectively been, I don't want to say uh, but uh put the right people have been put in place in power to ensure that all these interlocking organizations all come together and ensure that the narrative that the county wants to see implemented gets done because it's it there's billions and billions of dollars at stake here, and there's more than a few careers that are gonna be made and lost as a result of this.

Shawna 17:02

Yep, that that is the truth, and also a lot of people.

Steve 17:05

That is the Frankenstein, and that's the Frankenstein. The town is a pawn in the bigger game.

Shawna 17:12

Yeah, no, I know, in a game that again, most people playing don't even understand the roles of.

Steve 17:17

They didn't, and they were put in those, you know, it's and that was one of my favorite pieces to write because I got that phone call, not the piece, the the Frankenstein piece, but the one that goes back to this fall of last year. And it's that sinking feeling, right? Like that moment where you've been put into this position and you not you've been useful enough to be able to allow yourself to be a part of this and allow the the people around you, the politics, to get what they want. And I mean, I think, you know, on a very extreme case, we're seeing that with we saw that with Eric Swalwell. But even here, you know, people who are local, who, you know, they were propped up, they were given cell phone numbers, you know, hey, anything you need, call me, I'll be there for you. I got your back. And then when they got what they wanted, those phone calls don't get returned. And when things start happening and decisions are being made, and you pick up that phone and say, wait a minute, I don't want, you know, we're gonna ruin the heritage of this area. Why are we putting a storage facility on Woodbury? And people are like, I I can't take your call right now, or let me look into it, instead of I'll get you right back to you. Yeah, you know, everything, anything you need, I got you. Now it's you're not needed anymore. And it it it we always said it was gonna be in the nonprofit sector, but it's become more than that, and now it's that realization where you were played, and yeah, everybody was played. They were all played. Well, yeah.

Shawna 18:42

And except for those pulling the strings, they were all played.

Steve 18:46

Well, the the and the naysayers that saw it and said, Look, this is the game that's being played here. And you know, some of us have been through this before, some of us have seen how politics works at the big scale, and you know, let's be honest too, like this is not, you know, power politics Washington style. This is power politics, you know, Han Han Hall of Administration style. But you just know power politics is the same, it's just the degree of which it is changes just depending on the the set the setting of it. Yep. So I it was nice to write it because we did have the receipts. The sad part is we had to write it because we did have the receipts.

Shawna 19:26

I know. Well, the sad part is that we're here at all when we should we could it could have been avoided.

Steve 19:32

So one of the things that they used to that they always tell me in Washington is it's easier to fix the problem before you have to unnot it. Because once you start unnodding things, things get messy. We're in a position now where we have to start unnodding. And it's uh now we have to take bigger swings because we're behind the eight ball. If we want to have that position in California or in Los Angeles or in Altadina, we're gonna have to our town council is gonna have to exert itself and it's gonna have to do it in a way that plays power politics with the feds and bypasses the county and bypasses the city or the state. And that's gonna have to be, they're gonna have to say, look, we're not on board with what's happening here, and you know, we want to have more control. And I think if we do that, there are people that have relationships in Washington that are in our community that can open those doors, and it's not those that sit in the Oval Office for photo ops with the president because that's a whole different story because of who was also in that oval office when those meetings were happening. And I don't think a lot of people understood that piece of it. That was a very clear message to those of us who are in the game. So, anyway, sorry, Shauna. No, I love the inside baseball.

Shawna 20:48

I love it. I love I love the inside baseball. I know all the listeners do too. Um, the how this works and kind of understanding the behind the scenes is, I think, critical at this point, you know. Like we we have to be have the full awareness of what's happening if there's any hope of getting out of the mess.

Steve 21:04

So we also need to be paying attention to what's happening up in Sacramento because I know a lot of people are wondering why I'm writing so much about this gubernatorial, but that's gonna affect our rebuild too. Our governor killed our solutions, and our governor can make it too. So, like, I think we have to be mindful of what's happening up there as well.

Shawna 21:25

I agree. I agree, which is what again, to your point, why not just in your substack, but here while we've cut we've talked quite a bit about the players, and we won't do it today, but we will come back in another episode as things heat up as we're heading into the the primary, we've got our ballots, ballots uh my ballots here, you got your ballot, you know. It it's time. So, yeah, there'd be a lot more conversation.

Steve 21:46

So many people ask me about that one. They're like, I have no idea who to vote for.

Shawna 21:51

Who to vote for, I know it's a mess. Who do I hold my own? Anyhow, I don't want to, I don't want us to go down the rabbit hole of that comp because it's not our topic. Today, but also like I'm with you. I'm one of those people because I'm like, I don't like it. These people all suck. I don't like any of them. They're all problem.

Steve 22:07

My dad's line. My dad's line. I'll just leave it at this. The cream of the crap. That's what he used to call it.

Shawna 22:12

It is the cream of the crap. Like, how is this the best that we have to offer? Like it's not.

Steve 22:19

It's just that's who we've got stuck with. So yeah.

Shawna 22:22

Oh man. So the other big news, okay. The other uh big aside from all the of everything imploding and being the same, um, is the state farm news. Okay, so, and I just said, wow, I would have loved to have been a wall fly on the wall for this one, and what happened here. Can I roll my eyes at this one?

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Okay.

Shawna 22:39

You can you can roll your all eyes all you like. California Department of Insurance and Insurance Commissioner Ricardo Lara are now saying post their investigation, you know, they did their investigation, released their findings, um, that State Farm may temporarily lose its California license after findings tied to its handling of the 2025 claims. So for those who are not familiar. Yeah, exactly. So I'm gonna get into this because someone in my group, I loved it. She was like, oh, they said the DOI is threatening them with a good time.

Steve 23:09

Uh they get a speeding ticket and they don't have to write more policies. Oh, oops. I know.

Shawna 23:14

So I just said, like, why now? Who find like who got is this just I mean, it's clearly just more optics and someone, you know, being pressured into doing something. But, you know, this is absolutely more about optic than outcome because if we're being honest, how does this help anyone? It doesn't like I'm a state farm, you know, uh person, right? A state star state farm customer with a claim that is still ongoing. I'm on adjuster 13. I've never got my, you know, individual one person to hit my point of contact that you're supposed to. Um, you know, none of that has happened for me. Like anyhow, and like so many people, I'm just still fighting to get every dollar out of this flipping policy. And um, you know, someone in the, as I was, I was alluding to someone in the community said suspending their certificate, like the DOI wants to threaten them with a good time. Because, you know, this just gives insurance, as we've discussed in the past, another reason to stop writing policies, to pull out of this market entirely, which is what a lot of them have wanted to do. And then the penalties, I mean we start on the penalties. The penalties that are being discussed are, you know, millions, which is nothing. I mean, it's couch change for a billion, yeah, two million dollars. Couch change for a multi-billion dollar shot up mega corporation.

Steve 24:27

Anything over a million dollars is millions. Okay. Look, barely.

Shawna 24:31

This is but anyhow, it's the point is it's a it's a joke. It's nothing. And don't get me struck on the fact that those fines, it's not like those fines come to the people, it goes to the state. So, like, uh uh, make it make sense. This does literally nothing for anyone other than to absolve Lara and the DOI along with State Farm, going, well, they were naughty, and now we slap them on the wrist and we did our job, and now it's over and let's move on. And meanwhile, everyone's still in the same boat.

Steve 24:56

So last night, though, there was a lot on the debate about this because there was talk about um Javier Becerra saying how he wants to freeze or cap rates, and they talked, they started talking about this on mutt on Tuesday night. And everybody on the stage said basically, A, it's or they did this last week. They said A, it's illegal, and even to the extent that you can do it, you're just gonna collapse the market. The reality is that California's market is collapsing. Whether State Farm stops writing policies or not, who cares? We need to reimagine because the bigger issue here that nobody's talking about, except for those that know that I read my Substack, is the fact the larger insurance companies are pawing off or shifting the higher risk people into Calfair. So the state's taking on the risk and they're continuing to write policies, but they're moving away from wildfire risk so that they're not stuck with that anymore. And it's all on the state now. That's what Calfair is, essentially. And you know, we're we're getting to the point where the system is breaking. And whether it's whatever that we're gonna do with this is, I still believe we have to look at Calfair and we have to look at we don't really know what the profitabilities organizations are or not. Nobody knows. It's just this we're just gonna throw regulations out, and this has been a problem that they keep talking about. And it's just a lot of he said, she said. And until we have a public option that does this itself to determine whether or not these really are profitable lines of business or not, and this is really a profitable, you know, play this is a rate that makes sense for the market that we're in. And are we actually doing this market properly? All of this stuff is conjecture. And you know, what they did with State Farm with the optics is you said it's a bunch of BS.

SPEAKER_03 26:56

Yeah.

Steve 26:56

And I think that the reality is that this is a fundamental problem to California, but it's indicative of the broader problems that we've been seeing. And again, those that read my Substack know I've been writing a lot about these things because we have to address these problems. And sitting there and getting cheap political points while it makes us feel good, doesn't actually solve the problem. Because as we're rebuilding, people are gonna need insurance because especially the people who can't afford to rebuild and are having to take on extra debt, they're gonna have to have insurance to to finish the projects. Yeah, and yet nobody's addressing this problem.

Shawna 27:34

No, they're not. I mean, we've and like you said, we've we've talked about this quite a bit, and I and we've been talking about this in our groups um in our primary BA group quite a bit. I love the people, I love the BA people in the group, and I'm so lucky that I spend enough time in Altadina now that I get to see people in the wild all the time and I have the most amazing conversations. But I shared, I I have to share like some of the comments for that came from our community, the reactions to this news. And it was like, you know, I can't think of another industry where you pay for an advocate and they become your adversary when you need them most. Like, can you imagine hiring a lawyer when it comes time to go to court? They've joined the other guy. I mean, it is like that. Uh penalty, penalties to whom? So the state needs more money, the the state gets to benefit. Um, okay, this just gives them an exit. Others will follow. So now what? We lose our policies and start over. Um, other people are like, what about the California Fair Plan? Can we talk about that? That CFP is virtually insolvent and no one is having claims paid out through CFP. And then, of course, you know, let's not pretend that this is isolated. We've seen the same patterns across multiple carriers. You've got, you know, Mercury, all state farmers. There, there are people in the same circumstances that we are with State Farm, with all of these carriers all getting away with the same thing, and they're not even getting the wrist slab. You know, it's it's embarrassing. So I mean, it this is not a win. And I think, you know, we cannot allow it to be framed as a win because it's not a win. Well, it already has been.

Steve 28:57

As I and it will be.

Shawna 28:59

Well, well, that and it's absurd that it is because it's not. And um, that is it's it's more uh gaslighting. It's more just, you know, hey, telling everybody like, oh, everything's great.

Steve 29:10

But do you realize the political work it took to even get to this?

Shawna 29:15

Excuse me, which is embarrassing. Bless you, bless you, Steve.

Steve 29:19

But to get to this outcome, which is an embarrassment, like that the amount of work that it took to get there from the elected and the advocates in the community, etc. You know, it is a win from that perspective that they actually got something done, but it's not a win because it's not actually doing anything for us.

Shawna 29:41

It's nothing. It's more part. It's more performative policy, dressed up for press ops while the survivors keep, you know, bearing the brunt and doing the real work of recovery on their own. That's what it is.

Steve 29:53

Well, it it's it's it's very similar to everything you're seeing in the debates right now, in that there's a lot of talk about performance, but there's no real substance behind how we're gonna solve the fundamental problem.

Shawna 30:05

Exactly.

Steve 30:06

I mean, I think and it it's really bad.

Shawna 30:09

I'm not gonna, you know, I'm not gonna drag us into the mayoral race, you know, there for LA because that's definitely not a topic we're covering today. But I will just say to that point, because you and I have been talking quite a bit about this offline, um, you know, is Spencer Pratt, right? And that like, you know, a debate last night, like we you listen, listen, Pratt's MAGA Light. You can get into what a trash person he is via his reality show history. I mean, he he's I I always like to hold room for people to change. And I do believe to some degree this guy has definitely changed. I don't think he's still the same person who would sell nudes of one of the Olsen sisters or, you know, uh get sucked into the Mayan uh end of civilization thing and blow a million dollars on crystals. I would love to know if that story is real because I'm just so fucking amused by it. But anyhow, the point is that if you listen to that debate last night, while this guy may be arguably in some circles like a lunatic and fringe and this and that, and he's MAGA and he's all this stuff, he's the only one who actually sounds like he has a fucking clue. Even though he may have no clue at all about policy and has no business in the role, the fact that he's the only one who sounds like he has a clue is a disturbing reality. Like that's where we're at. And this is how Trump, like you and I have talked about this. This is how Trump happened, and everyone's like, he'll never win, he'll never win, he'll never win.

Steve 31:24

Authenticity matters. I mean, we're here. Yes, it does. Look, whether it's on the far left or far right, you're seeing it. I mean, authenticity is the key because we as voters and we as citizens are tired of the same old warmed over points and the same old warm-over bullshit. And when you get there and they get into office, they just sell themselves out for whatever it is. And you know, at this point, I think everybody's just they just want something. Look at what's happening in Maine with Graham Platiner. Graham Platiner, by all that's holy, shouldn't even be in that senatorial race. Yet the guy beat back Janet Mills because the attraction people have with him is that he's authentic. Yeah, he's a fuck up. Yeah, he's had problems. Yes, but he has a Nazi tattoo. But it's it's human. And I think that that's what people are saying is look, stop giving us robots, give us something real. And as I've said to people again, back to the governatorial race or the mayoral race, the thing we're seeing in California that's going to play out on the national stage, and I've always said 2026 here in California, is the prelude, is either, you know, and this is where I think Mahan missed is either you're going to attack the machine or you're going to be part of the machine. And you have to choose which one it is. You cannot be and when you attack, and you have to choose what it is that you're going to attack. Like you and I have not been brought in by the machine, and I don't think we'll ever be brought in by the machine because we've chosen to attack. But if you choose to attack, you also have to choose in a way that is, I've tried to make it so that centrist lane exists that we're not so far out of whack that you know people go, wait, you know, you're just you're Spencer Pratt, or you're, you know, I know we get I get called MAGA, but I'm not.

Shawna 33:19

You know, it's like that's laughable to me because you're so not you couldn't be further from that. But continue.

Steve 33:25

I was talking with a guy who's uh in the union, and we were talking about you know, he's he was involved with labor and politics, and I told him my theory on um on the insurance and how I think you know, especially at the at the state level with health insurance that need we need to have a public option. He goes, Are you kidding me? I said, No. I said, I I there, you know, with the in with the utilities. I'm the one who said, get rid of the private utilities. That it's a joke that we're using public risk for private benefit. Like I'm not, but to the extent that this has to be, the authenticity is critical. And you have to be authentic in who you are and what you are. You can't try to be, you know, uh an establishment person attacking things because it doesn't work. And I think that that's where people, or you can't be like the the New York Post put or the California Post put it well today about Mahan, is that he triangulates instead of just going at where he needs to get to, and that is why he is failing, which is again because of my stuff. No, I've been saying this all along. Oh, and you know, I mean, yeah, God, I would have loved that. I would have loved the lane he had wide open to him. I mean, when Lorena Gonzalez went after him, he was wide open to attack the machine and he missed. It's and he missed that unbelievable.

Shawna 34:36

But anyway, well, I mean, like like Nitya Raman last night, who you know, we were talking about again, I don't want to get too far, but like we talked about that, like she actually is really smart, but oh my gosh, she spec bombed spectacularly, um, which is frustrating to watch. It was bad. I watched parts of it and I was like, oh gosh, it's cringe.

Steve 34:57

Is that everybody, most people in California politics, especially on the Democratic side, whether the candidate or the people behind them, remember, it's a whole machine behind them. I mean, you have like campaign consultants, you got campaign people, etc. The campaign people want to continue to work in California politics. You can't go attack the machine and the establishment and then expect to get jobs afterward. I mean, they're they have long memory, so yeah, it may not even be the mayhans of the world that you know what he may have felt like, yeah, I'll go, but his advisor's like, you can't, because if you do, then I won't get a job. And it's like, well, that's why Steyr's refreshing because Steyer can do that because he's using Mandami's people who are not California and he doesn't care.

Shawna 35:39

Yeah. The only challenge again with him that you and I have discussed is that you know, no one has any taste for a billionaire at this point, just none.

Steve 35:46

Well, I he's too extreme anyway. I mean, he he's too much, and he's palpatine. He looks like the emperor from Star Wars. He's palpatine.

Shawna 35:58

It took me a minute. I thought you said he's palpitating.

SPEAKER_01 36:01

No, he's palpatine.

Shawna 36:02

Maybe that's no, yes, he's emperor palpitane. I got I got it. I got it. Uh, you know, I'm I'm a little bit of a nerd. Um, okay, that's hilarious to me.

Steve 36:10

Um, can't you picture him with like lightning coming out of his hands?

Shawna 36:17

Oh, say now you're taking me into another, it's a little more Marvel universe, but okay.

Steve 36:22

Um, that's Star Wars. Like, I just watched Return of the Jedi. I showed my daughter it for the first time. She goes, I want to watch the last one. I go, Okay, you're gonna watch Return of the Jedi, because that's it.

Shawna 36:32

That is it. I love it. So let's talk a little bit to there was some other news out of the Palisades that takes us to um Yes, yes, yeah, but it takes us to this, you know, this another topic that we've covered at length and that we talk about a lot, which is um You mean we have receipts again? Yeah, oh uh which is you know the money. Like I said, oh man, I said, I wish I had a dollar for every time we've asked, like, where's the money? Everyone's like, where's the money? Can we just have a dollar for that? Um it is this issue of of you know, of our nonprofit um, you know, sphere uh and how all this money is flowing and where it is and where it's not. So the really the sad, the sad news was that um, you know, Larry Vane and Larry's someone who, you know, I had had a few conversations with at the end of the year and earlier this year, um, you know, as I was, you know, doing some coordination with the Palisades and speaking at their They Let Us Burn rally, because you know, it's it's while they have different struggles, many of them are parallel to ours. Um, and um those conversations are absolutely worth having. But uh Larry um, you know, kind of came out of nowhere after the fire as a community member and started a group called Pally Strong. And um, you know, like in our community, there are multiple factions, you know, uh working through all of these things and while also collectively working through obviously a lot of trauma and grief. And um, you know, Larry kind of ended up in this like kind of uh position of, you know, uh creating comms. He create and he, you know, created, you know, an uh uh social media to, you know, he effectively started what I started 10 years ago at BA. He started around the fire. And ultimately, you know, that and he called it Pally Strong. And then ultimately that, you know, coalesced his group. And then we had other groups who felt that he was too close to and too connected to the people that they were fighting, which is you know, like for us, the bad is the county. For them, the bad is um is them is Mayor Bass. Um the villain. Uh yes. So, you know, in that.

Steve 38:42

Right?

Shawna 38:42

Correct. And that and that's how these things end up being framed. And um, you know, there there was a lot some there was not always agreement over there, just as there is not always agreement in our community. But the news this was that on Monday that um was that Larry had passed away and that it was suicide, um, that he had chosen to take his life. And I mean, I was just, you know, again, I as I said it, I said, well, the fire has taken another one of us, because it's, I think that as we've discussed also in the past on this on this show, um, it is countless the number of deaths that are related to this, not just suicides, not just the people who died those first nights, but like all the people who've died since of from various related things. And we've seen, you know, some of that data come out of Cedar Sinai with the excess deaths at cardiac events. If you go talk to anybody at Huntington Hospital, they'll tell you that they have seen a huge uptick in these uh incidences and deaths since the fire. But, you know, it was just, it was incredibly sad to see that that that had happened and that for whatever reason, he felt that that was his only way out or only choice and that, or that that was a best option. Um, and I think it's worth talking about the fact that, you know, um for disaster survivors, the trauma, the grief, the PTSD, a lot of that peaks in year two. And we are right in the thick of that. And it's a it's a good reminder to everyone to check in on your neighbors, spend a little extra time, uh stick around and ask one more question, be especially concerned for the people who insist that everything's fine and they're okay all the time because they're not, nobody is. So, you know, it was just a really, really sad to see, uh, regardless of how anybody, you know, felt or or agree, you know, whether there was agreement or not, that you don't want to see that happen to everybody.

Steve 40:33

Sort of the sentiment. I think that's been the sentiment over there, regardless. Yeah, you don't you don't want to see this happen to anyone. Your your political differences aside, you're you're still a human.

Shawna 40:44

And oh, 100%.

Steve 40:46

He had young kids and a family, and you know, he tried to give of himself in a way that he felt was right to get back to his community. And yeah, sometimes you get well, we don't know the details.

Shawna 40:59

Well, so there is um what this raised, it raised this other, you know, topic, which is, you know, that was very divisive in in the Palisades, which is that um, you know, Larry was Larry, you know, despite not having a nonprofit, not being a prior community leader, organizer, organizer, any of that, received a half million dollar fire aid grant um through um uh help me out, California Partners.

SPEAKER_01 41:29

Community partners.

Shawna 41:30

Thank you, community partners of California. And um there was a lot of criticism, you know. The he he, you know, he kind of put it, I think to quote him, he said, to our surprise, we were awarded a$500,000 grant from fire aid, but with strict limitations on how the funds could be used. And we were directed to continue our communications work and create a communications hub for the Palisade. So on its face, you know, okay, great. You know, so I there could people could be critical. And I think that unfortunately, the only reason that people are so critical is because, you know, there's a lot of ire as to like, well, why is this person getting all this money? And is this really where this money should go? And the only reason that people have to have that conversation is because the money is not flowing everywhere else it should. Right. I think that if the money were flowing everywhere else it should, this would not have been a conversation.

Steve 42:20

But I don't, I don't agree. That that world is extremely competitive and petty. I mean, the nonprofit communities. But this is not about the nonprofit communities.

Shawna 42:28

This was a this is about sentiment. This is about the sentiment amongst the people, just like the sentiment in our community where everyone is like, what the fuck is this fire aid money?

Steve 42:36

Yeah, I think it's fanned by the the competitiveness of yes, you're right. I mean, on a macro level, you're 100% right. That money never got down to the people it was supposed to. I mean, yeah, the allegations came out against fire aid, or no, after the fires, they, you know, they remember we wrote about that over I wrote about that over the summer, last summer, and you know, it was it was like the Fox News stuff, Spencer Pratt was all into this, and you know, they were exposing all the money, then they got Latham Watkins to come in, and then there was that whistleblower up trial that showed up for one day and then left, and then everybody was going to Washington, and then you know, the the machine decided, oh no, no, no, we got to give us a clean bill of health before we go to Washington. And the preliminary thing from Latham said, as they as the information was presented to them, everything looked kosher, but we didn't have Annandale's or Anand uh Annenberg's information and until you have Annenberg's information, because most of the money was going through Annenberg, it sort of seemed like, well, you can't just dismiss that. Never got a final audit, or at least it wasn't reported. Nope. The data that was compiled at the end of the year showed that there was a billion up to a billion dollars sent out, but most of that was through GoFundMe, and the real number was around 160 million. Uh the whole thing's a freaking joke. And I mean, yeah, the money should. Have gone to the people, and it never did. And I think what you know, again, tragedy sometimes opens the door to something more. And I think you know, there's those lines in that piece about how Larry himself sat down with some of the editorial groups or one of those circling the news, which is one of the most direct in criticism of how fire aid has been you know dealt with and how the fire response has been over there. They were really in on killing off ABC or SB 549 for Ben Allen. And that there was talk about how he was going to quote spill the beans, so to speak, in the next couple weeks.

Shawna 44:41

So, you know, it's like uh I wish I wish I wish Larry was around to tell the full story of what had happened here because you know it this was reported in the Pali Post, which is a local local paper where they said a few days after his his death, Sue Pasco, who's the editor of Circling the News, had reported that Vane met with her on April 16th. And at that time, Pasco said that he told her he had not asked for the grant. He said, I didn't ask for one, it wasn't his idea, and they just gave it to him. And according to Pasco, Vane claimed that he quote unquote had not been allowed to spend the money because he had to give some back to community partners and that he would elaborate in writing in a few weeks, and he uh was gone 11 days later.

Steve 45:26

I heard the number is 10% that that's the that's the fee that community partners was charging.

SPEAKER_04 45:35

Yeah.

Steve 45:36

So$50,000 out of that money, and I mean if you translate that for all those fiscal sponsors that are involved, because most of these organizations went through fiscal sponsors in one form or another, I mean the VIG is 10% on a on a hundred million dollars. That's$10 million that didn't go to fire victims.

SPEAKER_03 45:54

Yep.

Steve 45:55

Instead, it went to these fiscal sponsors that do what? They burdened it and allowed people to bypass the 501 requirements.

Shawna 46:05

I mean, which is you know, I don't it on its face, I don't have a problem with that. I think it's a great way to stand up organizations quickly after a disaster like this when you need to.

Steve 46:14

It's been manipulated, like the Wall Street Journal talked about back in December that I wrote about. And I mean, we don't know where we cannot account for where all this money has gone. And to the extent that the federal government's supposed to come in and flood this space with up to 20 billion dollars, I mean, I think the LA County ask is eight. Figure the city's probably similar. I mean, 16 to 20 billion in money. I mean, 10% of that. So let's just say, wait, first the county and the estate, the city will get theirs. And if we can get 10% from the fiscal sponsors, what do the county and the city get? I mean, you can start that number is gonna dwindle down pretty quick. And but even if you have$20 billion passing through, if fiscal sponsors are gonna get their hands on up to$2 billion of that just for administering this stuff, that's I you know, like I get I know those numbers are probably unrealistic, but it's even still, it's the same thing as the state.

Shawna 47:14

Yeah, it's the same thing as the state making a small killing, the state and the city and the county on sales tax on our rebuilds. Like this is they're gonna profiteer like crazy.

Steve 47:24

Yeah, but that money's going back to us, Shauna. Come on, they're using that money to help prop us up.

Shawna 47:29

Oh, that's right. Of course, it's gonna it's trickled down. It's trickled, it's trickled down everything, trickle down nonprofit logic that you know it's insane to me.

Steve 47:38

Um, we had our I do think this is a window, and I think that it's it's incumbent on our media and our electeds. I know the I know the Congress has uh you know, the uh his gap committee up at that's homeland, security, government, something uh homeland, security, and government committee and his gak at the Senate. And I'm sure oversight, well, no, oversight's not doing anything because Robert Garcia wouldn't touch this with a 10-foot pole. But um, you know, I they there should be people looking at this.

Shawna 48:09

Yeah.

Steve 48:09

And you know, I I think it's a question of when are we going to start really addressing some of these broader questions? Because think about homelessness, the$24 billion that we spent in the state, just in the state side of it, not even the federal money. How much of that money has gone through these fiscal sponsors and you know, administrative entities, etc. That you know, I I know when I was bringing up the idea of even just talking about workforce development from the homeless perspective, it was like, oh, you're taking a dollar away from building a facility or building an apartment for you know this person, yet 2.4 billion could have been just siphoned off, and how much could that have built? You know, yeah. I I'm just saying, and again, I these numbers are totally, I don't believe it, it's 2.4 billion. It could be who knows though. Like, how much of that money did not get to where it needed to get to? You know, we talk about fraud, waste, and abuse, and this is this is not illegal, but it sure as shit doesn't feel proper.

Shawna 49:08

No, it's not right. So when someone donates money to a cause, you want that money to go to the cause. And I think there's some you know acceptance that you may lose a little in an admin fee or or some other admin cost, but that should be minimal. Not I think normally that the numbers money just keeps going and going and going, and then the money never even gets where it's supposed to go.

Steve 49:31

Well, I think the number is normally three to five percent. But here's another question. You know, CPA mentioned to me when they read this stuff. They said, what if the money never got spent? Does it then go back to who? And then where is it allocated to? Is it washed at that point? You know, in the government, we call it laundering appropriations. And the what happens is, you know, the money goes into, say, Department of Veterans Affairs, right? And then VA says, okay, I need to go buy something. So then the VA will go buy it and then they'll pay themselves to buy the item, and then that money that they use to pay, like let's just say it's 5% of the money, that goes into an account, and that's no longer required to follow the appropriations, you know, where the restrictions on it, and that is called a supply fund, and that can be spent however you choose to. And you know, that's called laundering money. And I I'm what you know, they talked about this with some of the programs that I've been involved with, where fees are paid to nonprofits outside of the government to administer the program on the government's behalf, and then those monies, which were appropriated, are then spent however you choose. And I'm feeling like the fiscal sponsors feel a shitload like that. Yeah. They could be laundering those appropriations or those dollars or those restricted funds that would otherwise or should otherwise be going to the process. And then the worst part is they can then take that money and advocate on behalf of whatever they want. You know, in the program I was dealing with the federal government at the time, they could take the money that they were that organizations were regulatorily required to pay to these parent nonprofits. Think about them like a franchisee and a franchise or the franchise or could then take that money and lobby on behalf of the organizations to continue to keep the program going. But they also lobbied on behalf of themselves to make sure that they stayed in the position of power to keep getting their money. And I wonder how far this goes. I've seen it and I know it, and I could feel it. And it feels like they're the ones spending the money, you know, these fiscal sponsors tied into the, you know, the philanthropic foundational industrial complex who are flying back to Washington trying to get the CDBG money instead of focusing on solutions that we brought up here, solutions that have been palatable to the administration from the start. And I'm not saying I'm agreeing with the administration, I'm just saying at the end of the day, we have to do what it takes to get stuff to our people. And, you know, why have we wasted 16 months sitting there in the Oval Office with Darth Vader to continue our theme of Star Wars today? You know, when Russell Vott, who's the head of the Office of Management and Budget, sitting there with Karen Bass and Catherine Barger and the president, that's not because of a good thing. Russell Vott is the guy who guts every possible thing in the federal government. He led the doge efforts besides Elon Musk. He's not there because things are good.

Shawna 52:34

No, he's not.

Steve 52:36

I I just think like we are we are missing the thread here and all the things we we have wasted time and we have disaster goes. Yeah, and they've consolidated power, and we've been left in the background. And it's the the the receipts are coming due back to the Frankenstein thing. I mean, we're seeing now the results of it, and now it's up to us to say, you know what, we we have to stand up and stop what is happening.

Shawna 53:09

Yeah, I agree with you. I'm gonna just touch briefly, like we even have this playing out at our little hyper local level, you know, with our town council's fund. The town Altina Town Council administered a um GoFundMe fund and then was doing, you know, a little larger than microgrants, but like$500 to$1,000 grants that we it was really hard. Like even in our group, there was a there was a post with hundreds of comments, and no only one person in the comments had received this grant. So it was like, who's getting this money? Now, I don't think that the money went anywhere it wasn't supposed to. I don't. I think it did go to community members. I think it went to those most in need, which they were working on. And we're talking like people who are living in their cars and tents, and um that's great because that's exactly the intention for those funds. But what came up that was that was problematic was that one of the recipients. Um, so I'll first uh to explain when you received this money, it was all del uh distributed not directly to your bank account, like a typical GoFundMe, but it was done through a digital gift card. Okay. And um, one of the recipients was really alarmed when they, you know, because all of us are dealing with mega trauma, moving, displacement, grief, all these things, right? Like shit gets lost. Like I was saying, like I have a like a I got like a you know,$500 Target gift card at some point. And I have no idea where that thing is. Like I would love to use it actually. I don't even know where it is. But you know, because it's just that's how it is right now for survivors, and we're gonna be in this state for a long time. And um, you know, this in the state of California, there's a law that very clearly says that gift cards cannot have an expiration date, they cannot expire in the state. But it turns out there's a loophole for things like this, like where you're doing charitable donations, which is wild. And well, that's a whole other topic we don't have time for today.

Steve 55:03

But I'd love to know who carved out that I'd love to know who would I want out.

Shawna 55:07

Me too. How did that happen? Right. So all of this money is different that way, and the expiration date was really short. It's six months. So the person who got this money, one of this recipients, was like, hey, I'm gonna go do this, and was like, wait, I can't get my funds, like I can't get my thousand dollar grant because it's expired. It was like, so they went down the rabbit hole, right? So they went down the rabbit hole of like, where did this money go? And how does this work? And they got to the gift card company that is out of Australia called Prezi. And then the fact that if you did not utilize all of your funds on that digital gift card that came from this charitable, you know, donation, that the funds didn't go back to the fund, they didn't go back into the pool to be redistributed, it went as a fee to or an enrichment, shall we say, to this company in Australia called Prezi. So his thousand dollars went to Prezi. And um, I will say, you know, the the town council's been incredibly in the committee that worked on this incredibly transparent and open. And in fact, I I saw one of those people yesterday. She came to our business our office hours, um, our BA office hours, and we had a conversation about it and their frustration because they didn't have any idea that this could happen, and they're now working on some sort of blanket remedy, not just for the couple people who have who have come up, but for everyone, because you know, this is gonna be a lot of people who and then that's a lot of money. And again, I mean it's just nuts to me. When does the grift end? Where's the end of the grift? It doesn't matter. It's like the endless grift.

Steve 56:46

It doesn't, and that's the problem until we actually account for it and and hold our leaders accountable. It's not gonna happen.

Shawna 56:53

It just doesn't. Forgive me, I have a torn cuticle over here, like picking up my poor little cuticle.

Steve 56:59

I know you I know you gotta get going. I know you gotta get going.

Shawna 57:02

Well, I'm gonna I'm gonna say we we do have a couple things, you know. Uh we're gonna we're not quite gonna wrap it up yet because I know we both do have to get going, but I do want to wrap up a few. And we knew we were gonna run long today because we're gonna do one episode versus two, um, because Steve and I both have some things going on, but I do want to cover a a last few things. Like as we wrap up this topic, I just want to say it it came up around, there's been a lot of great conversation around the Met Gallo, right? That as I saw someone refer to it as the the Met Bayal, which cracked many of us. Like that's that was perfect. But um, you know, and the through that it was like the inherent colonialism of the charity model. And I'm I without going too far deep into that, maybe we'll cover it on another episode. I just loved that. And then you can go down like a big thought, rat, you know, uh hole of thought, but it is so true. It's like, you know, let a group of people steal the assets, literally steal in many cases, from other countries and individuals and put them in museums and put them in funds and then profit and take all the money from the from everybody else, and then you know, bestow again uh to you like, oh, let us do something so nice and give you some money back that we've stolen, you know, and it's it is true, it really is like this. And when you think about it like this, it's like it's I agree. You can say, Oh, Shana, but I completely agree with this. I think that it is, you know, this is inherently problematic because if there's foundations, there is enough money in this country for everyone. There is enough money in this country to do everything that we need to do, to take care of everyone, you know, that's it. But we choose not to do that. We choose to do to allow what we have allowed and for all this money to continue to flow up to the top. And you know, I I saw another great line that I love. It was like money's like manure. It's great when you spread it around, but when it piles up, it stinks. And that that could not be truer.

Steve 59:00

Donna Marx, folks, yeah.

Shawna 59:06

Uh listen, I'm not a Marxist, but there are just as you know, um, I'm not a lot of things, but there are elements of value in in all sorts of things. And if you want to be well read, I think it it is uh wise to be aware of them all, right?

Steve 59:23

I'm very well read. I've read all of it.

Shawna 59:25

I know you are. You're probably one of the most well-read people I know. That's very true. So I want to let's wrap this up with a quickie, because there are a few other big issues that that I don't think we can wrap this episode without covering. Um we're in a we're seeing a big showdown of the county versus the community on a number of issues, like as all of these things come to a head, and we're gonna have to kind of cover them quickly. But, you know, the one thing we we covered on our last uh uh episode was the fact that there were three projects coming up for discussion and and um input before the county signed them off. And you know, one is this Gyms car wash project where um uh the former gyms um at Lincoln and Altadina slated to be this like really gear. So, right, um, the issue of the Joe's Mobile that is doing an upgrade with a convenience store and also a car wash, and then also the the topic of RV and temporary housing um and the affordable housing unit. It was really interesting to see that the county, the the community was very clear the like they had an over, like a significant number of community responses to the surveys, which we don't always see, but people really had opinions on this and spoke out overwhelmingly against the GIMS project. Um, not on here is also the storage facility that is slated for the uh building where the Eaton Fire Collaborative is currently, or collaboratories it's called now, is currently located on Woodbury near the one-stop. Um, that EFC building is slated to become a multi-unit storage facility. Um, and people have been really quick to point out that none of this meets the West San Gabriel Valley plan that everyone was brought into and told by the county was, you know, going to be, you know, the template for how to do things. As we've pointed out repeatedly, we still have no economic development plan because, you know, surprised they don't want us to have one. Um the count the community was overwhelmingly aligned on all of these issues. And the county, it looks like, is still wanting to kind of push things through and just do their own thing. And this is going to be the real test because I think this is to where we started this episode with the town council. Um, this is the shitter get off the pot moment, where the town council is going to have to really write write a hard line and say, hey, we're standing up, the community does not want this.

Steve 1:01:46

Um But Shauna, they have to play it bigger than that. They have to play if we have the leverage to stop the federal money from coming in, then you need to stop doing your bullshit. I mean, it's that simple. And is that they have to make it so we are creating alternate options to what the county is proposing through the town council, such as economic development, small business security, you know, financing mechanisms that do not rely on CDBG and force the county to have to play ball or get out of the way. And it in unless they're willing to play hardball, which I doubt they are, this is a different game. And you're swimming in the shark pool with the biggest shark of all, Catherine Barker, who's been doing this for 35, 40 years. She knows it better than anybody.

Shawna 1:02:37

That woman is a pro.

Steve 1:02:38

It doesn't mean that she can't be brought to bear. Yeah. And it doesn't mean that she's not sensitive to the political environment, but it means that the cat the town council is going to have to play a little bit more rough than I think they're used to. And, you know, again, the leadership up to this point has been focused on just you know, healing the community and bringing the community. Now it's a question of okay, guess what? The county has not had our best interests at heart. And so, because of that, it's time to start having discussions about how we can take things into our own hands. We gave you U CRD, you pooped on us. You we gave you the opportunity to get the C D BG money, you pooped on us. We gave you the opportunity to set zoning, you're putting SB9 everywhere where the Palisades got exempted, and BS about the fire thing. If if Barger wanted to ask the governor for that, he could she could have gotten it. You know, the reality is we trust that these things are gonna be taken care of. I know, but the point is we trusted these things are gonna be taken care of. That, you know, the the that the county is going to do the proper assessments on properties and make sure that people are rebuilding properly. They're not doing shit. And we all know that. And that's gonna be a whole other thing. And so we're at a point now where the county has failed us again and again and again. And they can take all the credit they want for all the lot line to lotline houses that are going up throughout Al Tadena, but that's that's because they want to increase the parcel tax, and people don't even know that they're about to have their parcel tax increase at a level that's gonna be extraordinary over where they are now.

Shawna 1:04:12

Yep. So you you kind of you're jumping, you've you've jumped topics a little bit, Steve. But it is all right. We're gonna don't be sorry, we're gonna, we're gonna drive, we're gonna bring it all together because you know, we we have, like I said, this overwhelming community response and alignment to these projects and and what happens in this community and not wanting these things. Um, we have um, you know, we had a Colorado Boulevard story um that was talking about, you know, again, uh, and I'll link that for everybody, but really that was getting into the fact that, you know, again, with this money, where's all this money going? Who's the where's the accountability for the money? And, you know, also where's the accountability with the county, which kind of ties everything we're talking about in this episode together. Um, the other big issue that came up this week, and like I said, everything really is coming to a head right now. We are in a pressure cooker. Um, Elliot. So for anyone who doesn't know, Elliot Middle School on North Lake, um, I would say across from Dr. Vanderhoof's office. But um, what is that, Lake in Calaveras?

SPEAKER_03 1:05:08

Yeah.

Shawna 1:05:09

Yeah. Um, and I am forgive me if I'm wrong. I'm always getting my street names wrong, even though I've been here forever. Great. It is Calaveras. Um, you know, and anyone who recognizes it with a big tower, right? It's got the that big beautiful tower. So there's been a lot of time spent since the fire on trying to figure out how, you know, because it's such a historic structure, how to uh salvage it, how to rebuild it, how to keep it, some some of it, the integrity of that, that, that tower, even though it's not that exact tower. As you rebuild something and PUSD came out and said, Hey, no time, no money, not happening. It's all we're not saving it. We're not rebuilding the school. The whole thing's coming down. And what do you think is gonna go there? Oh, should we bet money now?

Steve 1:05:50

Here's the thing that should go there.

Shawna 1:05:51

Affordable housing.

Steve 1:05:52

Here's the thing that should go there. A park.

Shawna 1:05:55

Yeah, you know, we need more green space with the tower, a park. With the tower. So, you know, that that's again the tower.

Steve 1:06:03

But if we're going to give it a give us a park.

Shawna 1:06:06

Yep. Community's outraged about that, understandably. Altina Heritage has a petition going, and that's one of two petitions going. We're going to talk about also the petition thing briefly. But um, you know, you've got also the you know, the SB9 woes. Again, I've had so many people calling me in the last few weeks of like and and reaching out to me, like talking wanting to talk about SB9. Like, how did this happen? And we're contacting the governor because it's the governor's doing this to us. And that's like, no, that's not really what's happening. Let's like go back.

Steve 1:06:36

We didn't ask for the exemption.

Shawna 1:06:37

Ask for the exemption, exactly.

Steve 1:06:38

And the attitude is like, oh no, the whole idea that we have to get exempted from everything that's bad is ridiculous. That people don't want yet. We need exemptions from this, exemptions from that. You know, give Hollywood tax credits. Again, I understand why, but maybe the tax burden overall is too much. And why should you know small business owners be subsidizing multinational corporations?

Shawna 1:06:59

Like, and the middle class, and the shrinking middle class and working class.

Steve 1:07:03

This is all a microcosm of all the problems that we have here in California right now.

Shawna 1:07:09

Yep, it is. So you you've got that, you know, and and so people are really kind of waking up to like, oh my gosh, SB9, really bad. Like, this is happening next door to me. This is happening on my street, this is happening everywhere.

Steve 1:07:21

We're gonna we're gonna have everyone's gonna have Kato Kalen in their backyard. I mean, I heard that conversation. You know, everyone's okay. We won't be able to address parks.

Shawna 1:07:29

You won't have water, you won't you won't you won't have water because we have no infrastructure for this increased density. You won't be able to traverse your street because some of this shit's going up on streets that are already one barely one lane when their cars parked. Um, and there's no parking because there's no parking requirements for any of this. There are no that's part of what SB9 did, no parking requirements. So it's it's now that people are seeing how not only I'll find out what it's like to be a landboard in California in Southern California. But they're not, and that is the other fallacy. We have been fed this line that this is going that SB9 and this density and this increase of ADUs is going to support, you know, some of the families that have lost general generational wealth, their ability to recoup that, except that is like it may as well be more trickled down economics. It's not happening. Those are not the people who are doing this. It is developers, it's new property owners, it, you know, as these properties flip. It is not that. So the community is starting to get to really kind of wake up to this reality. They're not happy. There's a petition going out, specific a petition going around specifically around a project on Punahu, Punahu, Punahao, Punahu. Um, and that thing, it's a 5,000 square foot lot that is gonna have three condo-like units on it. It's insane. But that is what's happening on every street. So people are really riled riled up about this. But I'm like, it is literally on every street, guys. This isn't just one street, it's everywhere. So what are we doing about it? And now everyone's waking up and they're freaking out. So I want to say a note about petitions quickly, because there's a petition from Altina Heritage, there's a community about Elliott, there's a community petition around this project on Punahu and SB9. But the the bigger pieces, aside from the fact that the Altina Heritage petition is missing, missing one of the biggest things of concern, in my opinion, and and hearing this from people in our group, that, like all of our commercial areas, should have been cleared before anyone came back in the community. But because they were not included and we didn't get that complete cleanup, it didn't happen. And now you're talking about massive, massive demo of a historic massive campus that's full of fire toxicity and asbestos around standing homes that people just spent a year and their own money because insurance wouldn't pay to remediate and get back in their homes. And now we're going to recontaminate them. No big deal, nothing to see here. Um, so that aside, I really want to talk about the petition thing quickly, as fast as I can for people. Petitions make us feel good because we took 10 seconds online and we did something, but they do nothing. They are wildly ineffective. They are a good tool to bring awareness to an issue, but they are not a tool to actually do anything actionable around an issue. But what does work truly is reaching out directly to your electeds when you are a constituent, blowing up their phones, blowing up their emails. If you look at, if you even look at these petitions, let alone take the time to sign a petition, you must, must, I implore you, I beg you, you have to call and write all of your elections. It's Barger's office, it's Judy Chu, it's Sasha Perez, it's John Herabedian, it's and in some cases as benign, it's Newsom's office. You call it correct. You have to do it. It works. If they heard from literally one-fifth of the people who sign these petitions directly, this shit would change and get shut down. But nobody does that. They don't take the direct action. So, folks, you've got to mobilize, you have to do that. Uh, please, you know, tell your friends and neighbors, take a minute and do it. If they actually hear from us in phone calls, hear from us in emails. I'm actually working on a big thing to put out on Substack to help guide people to through doing this. So it's a copy and paste of a note and copy and paste of an email or you know, a quick phone number at your fingertips. This is how we actually change something. I mean, this is also playing out around the SCE undergrounding. And again, no plan, no uh, no cohesive anything. Uh, it's playing out really badly for the neighbors on Alzada, who are up. Um, for anyone who doesn't know, that's north of Loma Alta off Cheney Trail. I actually almost bought a place on Alzada years ago myself, and I was afraid of the fire. I was afraid of it, of the fire risk of that high. Oh, the irony. But uh, you know, their undergrounding plan is terrible and it puts vaults, it puts those massive um vaults in front of people's properties every few feet. It's insane. Uh, you and for anyone who doesn't know, like those things, that's a choice. That's a that's a financial choice. If they want to spend the money, you could have those things undergrounded too. It's what they do in a lot of communities, Pasadena. Um, it's look at Claremont. Like it's it's all around us where that's done. They don't have to be in front of just people's homes. So, you know, this is this is the moment. This is the moment where there are opportunities for our community to rally together and stand up for one for for itself and for one another and put an end to the to some of this, or at least, you know, make a stand and for the town council to do the same. This is this is the moment. It's not gonna get better.

Steve 1:12:37

I think the answer to, and again, as much as that's the case, and Shada, you're right. This is where you're great, fight the man, go for it. I'm with you.

Shawna 1:12:47

But I think fight the man, it's just we can't lay down and expect it just to happen.

Steve 1:12:52

It's a dual, but it has to be done dually. Like this is the point. You know, you're good at that side of it, but the town council is also gonna have to play hard and they're gonna have to show up in what you know with Washington, letting them understand that they're not in alignment with what's happening here, that you know, like the Palisades has done, that there are multiple voices here. And if they all those voices are not singing out the same hymnal, and we're willing to give Washington what they want, where the the county can't, because uh District 1 and District 2 want to take all of our money and create an economic crisis down there. You know, we need to be able to bypass this stuff. And we're being held up because of politics, not because of capability. And there are ways that the town council can utilize its position as leverage either over the county or actually give us what we want. And that is a path toward potentially what you've talked about many times, which is incorporation. We've reached a point where our interests aren't being looked out for. And this is a 40,000-person town, and it's being used as a you want to talk about colonization? This is a colonization. I mean, we are literally being used as a as an afterthought to just enrich those folks down in downtown at the county hall of administration. And it we're not getting our true seat at the table. And that is the purpose of having an advisory council like the town council. And if they're not gonna be listened to, then they can go advise someone else. And I know there's people in Washington that would listen to them. Yep. And by the way, that's the truth. I know a guy who can help you there.

Shawna 1:14:29

Yeah, we know a guy. Yeah, it's true. I know, I know. Um, let's, I mean, there's so much more to talk about in this.

Steve 1:14:39

In the oval, that would be pretty funny.

Shawna 1:14:44

Oh man, on that note, on that note, let's let's go into our small biz uh bit because I know sadly I've got to run out the door here in a minute. Yes, yes, yes, yes. So Steve was very adamant that he wanted to handle the uh small biz roundup today because you know it's time for him to get to deliver his ode to the dive bar.

Steve 1:15:05

I was in Bar Betsy the other night, uh the other day getting lunch for my wife and I. And you know, we were just talking about how we don't have a dive bar. And you know, we were talking about the rancho, and you know, how a lot of us have very fond memories of the rancho. I'm sure everybody's got a rancho story that has lived in Altadena for longer than a year or two. Um, and usually it probably involved a night that you probably shouldn't have gone there, but you end up there anyway.

Shawna 1:15:29

Or a morning because that bloody Mary was so good.

Steve 1:15:33

So, you know, and just I it's more a request to whomever comes in here if we ever get an economic development plan that give us another rancho, you know, like give us something like that where the community I know that the Eagles Hall has become sort of the filler for that, you know. But at the end of the day, it it was something that it helped identify, it really encapsulated what Altadena was, right? You know, the idea of everybody came together at the rancho, and it really was that moment where all the different parts of the town kind of crossed and mixed. And everybody, if you said the word rancho, everybody had a smile on their face and they knew what you were talking about. And I think if there's anything that we can keep from Altadena from what was as we moved to the transition, it's that type of whatever it's gonna be, whether they rebuild the rancho or not, or whether we do something else. I I put it out there for all the great restaurateurs and entrepreneurs in this community. Please give us another rancho.

Shawna 1:16:34

Yeah, yeah. I mean, the rancho itself wants to come back. There's a GoFundMe.

Steve 1:16:38

We've talked about it before. I've heard I've heard that there's there's questions as to whether it will be come back or not.

Shawna 1:16:44

I know, I know. I've heard that too. I hope that they can. I mean, it's just so hard. And also, how do you how do you recreate a dive bar? It's the age, it's the patina, it's the it's the funk in the carpet, you know what I mean? It's the sticky stools.

Steve 1:16:59

Like, look, there are things that can be done, right? You don't have to create the exact dive bar, but just something with that flavor, you know. You don't have the just something to give us for the next generation that runs through Altadina a place that's a gather a communal gathering place in some respects. I tried to get the club, the Altadena Town of Country Club to do it. I wanted them to put up a trailer that we can turn into a dive bar because of their uh liquor permit and you know put up some Christmas lights and just be able to let the community go there and just kind of you know stumble home.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:32

But you know.

Steve 1:17:51

Yeah, but they don't get permission from us to do what they want to do, so yeah, and go by and see my boy uh Malcolm Marble and his just too nice if you need some good athletic clothes. Everybody my kids swear by it.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:17

The whole purpose of it is bread. I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm just bugging you, I'm just bugging you, I'm just bugging you.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:08

Thank you, Shauna.

Steve 1:22:11

All right, you you doing your sign off? You're always good at that. I don't know, don't we tell them like you can go to all your things and I go to go to all my things and all the policy walk, and I'm just on Substack, I don't do all the other stuff.